On 2/5/2020 3:03 AM, between "Alexander Koryagin : August Abolins":

PS: Have you solved the problem with Russian text copy
pasting?

No. It is not critical. I primarily wanted to maintain UTF-8 characters copied into your Reformator/Quoter program no matter what language I encountered.

Meanwhile, I learned that I can avoid copying UTF-8 characters into the Reformator/Quoter program and adjust the quoting manually.


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Hi, August Abolins! ->Alexander Koryagin
I read your message from 06.02.2020 02:26

PS: Have you solved the problem with Russian text copy pasting?

No. It is not critical. I primarily wanted to maintain UTF-8
characters copied into your Reformator/Quoter program no matter
what language I encountered.

Well, I ask just for interest -- can you type and see a Russian text using the windows program called "Notepad"? (It manages simple ASCII texts).

Meanwhile, I learned that I can avoid copying UTF-8 characters into
the Reformator/Quoter program and adjust the quoting manually.

For instance, you are on a web page with a UNICODE coding. Then, you select some text, copy it and paste it into ASCII app like Notepad. The system must transform UNICODE to ASCII automatically. Microsoft Windows I mean.

So, tell me -- can you paste a Russian text into Notepad Windows app.

PS: You can also describe the way how I can get the problem artificially.

Bye, August!
Alexander Koryagin
english_tutor 2020

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On 2/7/2020 1:12 AM, between "Alexander Koryagin : August Abolins":

.. I primarily wanted to maintain UTF-
8 characters copied into your Reformator/Quoter program no
matter what language I encountered.

Well, I ask just for interest -- can you type and see a
Russian text using the windows program called "Notepad"? (It
manages simple ASCII texts).

My Windows system operates in codepage 437 by default. Notepad will only work using the current codepage. BUT, I can change the codepage to 866 (Russian) and the Russian chars I produce can *then* be copied into Notepad just fine! :) I did not know that, but it works!

However, the same Russian characters that are then in the clipboard, will still not render in Reformator/Quoter. :( Anything non-ASCII will just come out as "?????????" characters.

So, tell me -- can you paste a Russian text into Notepad
Windows app.

Actually, that *does* work! And, I don't seem to have to change the codepage. Interesting.

PS: You can also describe the way how I can get the problem
artificially.

I just copied some text I entered here:

https://russian.typeit.org/

...and I copied it into Notepad, and it looked the same. But when I copy into Reformator/Quoter, I only get "????????" characters.

Even something from google translate has the same results:

what's new? = что нового?

But in R/Q it looks like:

what's new? = ??? ???????



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Quoted with Reformator/Quoter. Info = https://tinyurl.com/sxnhux

--- Thunderbird 2.0.0.24 (Windows/20100228)
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Hi, August Abolins! ->Alexander Koryagin
I read your message from 08.02.2020 06:32

But in R/Q it looks like:

what's new? = ??? ???????

Well, it works differently and strangely on different operational systems.
In my Windows 7 I did it as you said, and I've got "??? ???????" in Reformator and a correct Russian text in Notepad.

In short, if such a thing happens there is a simple way to overcome it on all systems. But for this you have to set up the keyboard language switch on your Windows desktop.

ENG/RUS keyboard switch must appear in the low-right corner of your windows. It will allow you type ENG or RUS texts on your _real computer keyboard_ (not virtual).

Read it how to set up such a switch. Note that I describe it as it looks in Windows 7.

1. Run the Control Panel -> "Clock, Language and region" -> "Change keyboard and other input methods." -> "Keyboard and languages" -> Change keyboards-> tab General.
2. Add the Russian keyboard (actually you can add as many languages as you wish). Go to the tab "Language Bar" and set "docked in the taskbar". Go to "Advanced key settings" tab and look for the action "Between languages" -- it set up the keys which will switch ENG/RUS input.

If you now have the keyboard switch in your windows try to do this again:

1. go to https://russian.typeit.org/
2. Type some Russian text there using the virtual keyboard.
3. Change keyboard switcher of your computer to "RU". After that select some Russian text with your mouse and copy it to the clipboard.
4. Press "From clipboard" In the ReformatorQuoter.

PS:
5. Tell me the result ;-)

Bye, August!
Alexander Koryagin
english_tutor 2020

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On 2/8/2020 2:36 PM, between "Alexander Koryagin : August Abolins":

If you now have the keyboard switch in your windows try to
do this again:

1. go to https://russian.typeit.org/
2. Type some Russian text there using the virtual keyboard.
3. Change keyboard switcher of your computer to "RU". After
that select some Russian text with your mouse and copy it to
the clipboard. 4. Press "From clipboard" In the
ReformatorQuoter.

PS: 5. Tell me the result ;-)

That is brilliant. I *do* have multiple keyboards set up primarily for Latvian and English. Now, added RU.

I can make is work, almost.

In order to get a reasonable result, I have to,

[1] switch keyboard to RU.
[2] copy the Russian text at website into clipboard.
[3] open Ref/Quo, switch to RU.
[4] press "From clipboard".

...but the text changes a bit.

This is in the clipboard:

До свидания

Спасибо

But it looks "different" when I paste it into Ref/Quo.

See:

http://pics.rsh.ru/img/ref-quorussiantest_jo9oo3o4.jpg

As you can see, RU is selected for Ref/Quo.

I do not see the proper Russian letters in Ref/Quo.

But, when I highlight the "different" text in Ref/Quo back into my editing program (or this message program) it changes to proper Russian letters!

I can live with the "difference" while quoting the original message in Ref/Quo if the "real" letters will show up once the text is copied. This result is much better than the "??? ???????" ! :)

Спасибо

--
Quoted with Reformator/Quoter. Info = https://tinyurl.com/sxnhux

--- Thunderbird 2.0.0.24 (Windows/20100228)
* Origin: nntp://rbb.fidonet.fi - Lake Ylo - Finland (2:221/360.0)

Hi, August Abolins! ->Alexander Koryagin
I read your message from 09.02.2020 06:00

If you now have the keyboard switch in your windows try to do this
again:

1. go to https://russian.typeit.org/
2. Type some Russian text there using the virtual keyboard. 3.
Change keyboard switcher of your computer to "RU". After that
select some Russian text with your mouse and copy it to the
clipboard. 4. Press "From clipboard" In the ReformatorQuoter.

PS: 5. Tell me the result

That is brilliant. I *do* have multiple keyboards set up primarily
for Latvian and English. Now, added RU.

I can make is work, almost.

In order to get a reasonable result, I have to,

[1] switch keyboard to RU.
[2] copy the Russian text at website into clipboard.

Yes. The main thing is "switch keyboard to RU" before copying into the clipboard.

[3] open Ref/Quo, switch to RU.

It doesn't matter if Ref/Quo is in the Rus mode or Eng mode. When you switch the language in Ref/Quo you just replace the texts of the menu items.

[4] press "From clipboard".

..but the text changes a bit.

??. Ref/Quo makes only a few changes when you paste the text into it -- for instance, on the web site there are quoter marks like << >>. Req/quo will change them to the standard form "".

PS:
If you use Thunderbird for Fidonet you should know its unpleasant feature (important only if you try to send messages with not English symbols):

Suppose, you set up an American ASCII coding page for your messages. If you paste (into the Thunderbird editor) a text where even one symbol is not ASCII (for instance an exotic quoter mark or a long dash) Thunderbird will automatically change coding system in your message to UTF-8.
It is important for Fidonet -- in Fidonet almost nobody can read words written in UTF-8. When you send your message with Russian letters the Russian words will look as hieroglyphs for those whose editors support ASCII texts only.

In short -- if you paste a text into Ref/Quo [using "From clipboard" button] it filters the text from all not ACCII symbols (or replace them with ASCII analogs if they exist).

Bye, August!
Alexander Koryagin
english_tutor 2020

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On 09/02/2020 4:46 a.m., Alexander Koryagin : August Abolins wrote:

[3] open Ref/Quo, switch to RU.

It doesn't matter if Ref/Quo is in the Rus mode or Eng mode.
When you switch the language in Ref/Quo you just replace the
texts of the menu items.

Hello Alexander!

What I meant by "RU" above was switching the keyboard to RU.

Your program has "RUS" and "ENG" buttons for switching the menu
language, but that is not what I meant. ;)

[4] press "From clipboard".
.. but the text changes a bit.

??. Ref/Quo makes only a few changes when you paste the text
into it -- for instance, on the web site there are quoter marks
like << >>. Req/quo will change them to the standard form "".

I have not noticed the changes to the << >> characters, yet. But thanks
for the heads-up.

Meanwhile, there are couple of other things your program "changes" as
soon as the quoting is applied. :( I'll send that info to you in email.

PS: If you use Thunderbird for Fidonet you should know its
unpleasant feature (important only if you try to send messages
with not English symbols):

In fidonet, most echos are expected to be in plain old ascii. But
utilizing the correct CHARS kludge is acceptable in some echos to aid in implementing the correct character set for viewing.

...If you paste (into the Thunderbird editor) a text
where even one symbol is not ASCII (for instance an exotic
quoter mark or a long dash) Thunderbird will automatically
change coding system in your message to UTF-8.

Actually, UTF-8 seems to be fine solution that supports any language.
;) I like it.

Some fidonet editors such as (GossipEd) offer UTF-8 support, I've heard.

...It is important
for Fidonet -- in Fidonet almost nobody can read words written
in UTF-8. When you send your message with Russian letters the
Russian words will look as hieroglyphs for those whose editors
support ASCII texts only.

UTF-8 "includes" ascii.

UTF-8 seems to solve the problem of worrying about changing system
character sets or keyboards.

That is why I wondered if your fine program could/would support UTF-8, someday(?).



--
Quoted with Reformator/Quoter. Info = https://tinyurl.com/sxnhuxc

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Hi, August Abolins! ->Alexander Koryagin
I read your message from 09.02.2020 20:22

Meanwhile, there are couple of other things your program "changes"
as soon as the quoting is applied.: ( I'll send that info to you in
email.

I have replied to you.

PS: If you use Thunderbird for Fidonet you should know its
unpleasant feature (important only if you try to send messages
with not English symbols):

In fidonet, most echos are expected to be in plain old ascii. But utilizing the correct CHARS kludge is acceptable in some echos to
aid in implementing the correct character set for viewing.

But if we want our messages to be read by all people we should not use UTF-8.

...If you paste (into the Thunderbird editor) a text where even
one symbol is not ASCII (for instance an exotic quoter mark or a
long dash) Thunderbird will automatically change coding system in
your message to UTF-8.

Actually, UTF-8 seems to be fine solution that supports any
language. ;) I like it.

Some fidonet editors such as (GossipEd) offer UTF-8 support, I've
heard.

Some but not all.

...It is important for Fidonet -- in Fidonet almost nobody can
read words written in UTF-8. When you send your message with
Russian letters the Russian words will look as hieroglyphs for
those whose editors support ASCII texts only.

UTF-8 "includes" ascii.

If we write in the Latin symbols there is no problem.

UTF-8 seems to solve the problem of worrying about changing system character sets or keyboards.

That is why I wondered if your fine program could/would support
UTF-8, someday(?).

I have used quite old CBuilder 6 (it is 20 years old), but I believe that modern developing tools support any UNICODE operations.

Bye, August!
Alexander Koryagin
english_tutor 2020

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