Hello,

Is it possible to run C=Net or AmigaExpress under Amiga Forever with Workbench 1.3 installed and running?

Thanks



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.10-alpha (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

On 07 Nov 2019, Ched Chellios said the following...

Hello,

Is it possible to run C=Net or AmigaExpress under Amiga Forever with Workbench 1.3 installed and running?

Thanks

I would doubt they would run on 1.3, I don't remember if 1.3 had Hard Drive compatibility?!?! You are running Amiga Forever just use 3.1 that comes with it. CNet runs great under that.. I currently run CNet under 3.9 and have run
it under 4.1 but it's a little rough around the edges on 4.1..

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A43 2019/03/03 (Windows/32)
* Origin: The Wrong Number Family Of BBS' - Wrong Number ][ (1:267/157)

On Thu 7-Nov-2019 3:29a, Ched Chellios@1:226/16.0 wrote:

Hello,

Is it possible to run C=Net or AmigaExpress under Amiga Forever with Workbench
1.3 installed and running?

Thanks

--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.10-alpha (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

I ran C-Net 3.5 on WorkBench 1.3 a long time ago on real hardware. Like Al says, I think you should try v5 on WB3.1 or better.

/ JoinLink - AmigaNet - ArakNet - C=Net - FidoNet - RetroNet.
/ Multi-Terminal Support: ANSI Ascii & Skypix! 40/80 Columns.
--- CNet/5
* Origin: Reign of Fire: rofbbs.cnetbbs.net:2300 * (931)494-9100 (1:154/50)

I don't remember if 1.3 had Hard Drive compatibility?!?!

AmigaOs 1.3 was the first version that could boot directly from a hard drive. Earlier versions could use them but you needed to boot from a floppy.

--- NiKom v2.5.0
* Origin: NiKom BBS, http://www.nikom.org/nikombbs.html (2:201/420.0)

On Nov 7th 10:30 pm Al DeRosa said...

comes with it. CNet runs great under that.. I currently run CNet under 3.9 and have run it under 4.1 but it's a little rough around the edges on 4.1..
--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A43 2019/03/03 (Windows/32)

I had the wrong version of Amiga Forever, I just upgraded it so I can now use WB 3.x.. gonna have some fun! :)



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.10-alpha (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

On 30 Nov 2019, Charles Stephenson said the following...

I had the wrong version of Amiga Forever, I just upgraded it so I can
now use WB 3.x.. gonna have some fun! :)

Nice.. You will like 3.x whether it is 3.1.4 or 3.9, even 3.1 with the right addon's they are all really good. I run my BBS on 3.9, it is very stable and runs very nice..

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A43 2019/03/03 (Windows/32)
* Origin: The Wrong Number Family Of BBS' - Wrong Number ][ (1:267/157)

WB3.1 has been my backbone for the last 9 years. Its just enough to run a dedicated BBS. Now for playing around with WB3.9 would be nice. I am thinking on re-doing my Amiga Laptop to a new version of WB over 3.1

/ JoinLink - AmigaNet - ArakNet - C=Net - FidoNet - RetroNet.
/ Multi-Terminal Support: ANSI Ascii & Skypix! 40/80 Columns.
--- CNet/5
* Origin: Reign of Fire: rofbbs.cnetbbs.net:2300 * (931)494-9100 (1:154/50)

On Dec 6th 2:57 am Al DeRosa said...

On 30 Nov 2019, Charles Stephenson said the following...

I had the wrong version of Amiga Forever, I just upgraded it
so I can now use WB 3.x.. gonna have some fun! :)

Nice.. You will like 3.x whether it is 3.1.4 or 3.9, even 3.1 with the right addon's they are all really good. I run my BBS on 3.9, it is very stable and runs very nice..
--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A43 2019/03/03 (Windows/32)

Are you running it under Windows or Linux?



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.10-alpha (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

Hello Niklas!

12 Nov 2019 11:22, Niklas Lindholm wrote to Al DeRosa:

I don't remember if 1.3 had Hard Drive compatibility?!?!

AmigaOs 1.3 was the first version that could boot directly from a hard drive. Earlier versions could use them but you needed to boot from a floppy.

correct, it was just evolution harddisk that maked a hack to make it boot on kickstart 1.2

crap, but it worked :)


Regards Benny

... there can only be one way of life, and it works :)

--- Msged/LNX 6.1.2 (Linux/5.4.12-gentoo-x86_64 (x86_64))
* Origin: I will always keep a PC running CPM 3.0 (2:230/0)

I am using Workbench 3.1 on the harddrive and its working fine for
me.

Ditto.


--- NiKom v2.5.0
* Origin: Delta City (deltacity.se, Vallentuna, Sweden) (2:221/242.0)

Re: Re: Workbench 1.3
By: Al DeRosa to Charles Stephenson on Mon Dec 02 2019 07:37 pm

I had the wrong version of Amiga Forever, I just upgraded it so I
can now use WB 3.x.. gonna have some fun! :)

Nice.. You will like 3.x whether it is 3.1.4 or 3.9, even 3.1 with the right addon's they are all really good. I run my BBS on 3.9, it is very stable and runs very nice..

Hello Al!

This is a VERY old email, and since I JUST got fido working again on this BBS it's new to me! :)

I've bought Amiga Forever I've been playing with it. I REALLY like it. My goal is to run a Amiga VM in Ubuntu and set up Amiga Express and setup a true Amiga BBS. Since I have Corona I'll have time to do it now....
--- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
* Origin: The New Frontier ][ BBS [frontierbbs.net:23] - OH (1:226/17)

On Mon 20-Apr-2020 20:18 , Charles Stephenson@1:226/17.0 said to Al Derosa:

@NOTE: SlyEdit 1.73 (2020-03-31) (ICE style)
Re: Re: Workbench 1.3
By: Al DeRosa to Charles Stephenson on Mon Dec 02 2019 07:37 pm

I had the wrong version of Amiga Forever, I just upgraded it so I
can now use WB 3.x.. gonna have some fun! :)

Have you tried WinUae? Its freeware.
--- CNet/5
* Origin: 1:275/201.0 (1:275/201.30)

On Mon 20-Apr-2020 8:18p, Charles Stephenson@1:226/17.0 said to Al Derosa:

I've bought Amiga Forever I've been playing with it. I REALLY like it. My goal is to run a Amiga VM in Ubuntu and set up Amiga Express and setup a true Amiga BBS. Since I have Corona I'll have time to do it now....
--- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
* Origin: The New Frontier ][ BBS [frontierbbs.net:23] - OH (1:226/17)

Sorry to hear you have Corona and I pray for a speedy recovery. I am not sure how well AmigaForever will work, but I have seen quite a few C-Net boards on WinUAE and now one on MorphOS. So see what you can do and keep us informed.

-Spitfire Inc presents 4 Unique Systems...

Reign of Fire rof.cnetbbs.net:2300 C-Net Amiga Pro BETA System.
Reign of Fire II rof.cnet64.com:6400 C-Net DS-2 BETA System.
Reign of Fire III rof.cnetbbs.net:6800 C-Net Amiga v3.05g
Reign of Fire Vice rof.cnet64.com:6502 C-Net DS-2 on Windows!
* C-Net/5

* Origin: rof.cnetbbs.net:2300 * rof.cnet64.com:6400 (1:154/50)

Hello Al!

This is a VERY old email, and since I JUST got fido working again on
this BBS it's new to me! :)

I've bought Amiga Forever I've been playing with it. I REALLY like it.
My goal is to run a Amiga VM in Ubuntu and set up Amiga Express and
setup a true Amiga BBS. Since I have Corona I'll have time to do it now.... --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux

Cool.. You will like it especially since you have all the ROMS and install disks needed to get going.. Be careful with VM's running the emulators they will slow you down. Basically, you are running a emulator inside an emulator.
I found I just run WinUAE on a seperate PC which I consider my Amiga PC...

Be careful with the Corona! I am just getting over it, I was fine for 11 days then all hell broke loose!! I ended up in the hospital because I was so badly dehydrated, because I couldn't keep anything down, not even water!! When I
got to the hospital they tried to get blood and the poor nurse was literally punching my arm with all her might to get a vein but they were all
collapsing! So my advice? Don't screw around with it, stay hydrated even if
you can't keep anything down do your best to, and if you feel even a little dehydrated get your doctor on the phone and see what they want to do!~! This thing almost killed me!!

Al

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
* Origin: The Wrong Number Family Of BBS' - Wrong Number ][ (1:267/157)

Cool.. You will like it especially since you have all the ROMS and
install disks needed to get going.. Be careful with VM's running the emulators they will slow you down. Basically, you are running a emulator inside an emulator. I found I just run WinUAE on a seperate PC which I consider my Amiga PC...

Emulating an emulator is like googling google. The world will come to an end
;)

|15frank |08// |15netsurge
|07disksh0p|08!|07bbs |08% |07bbs.diskshop.ca |08% |07mystic goodness |11SciNet |03ftn hq |08% |07https://scinet-ftn.org

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/04/13 (Linux/64)
* Origin: % disksh0p!bbs % bbs.diskshop.ca % SciNet ftn hq % (1:229/101)

Re: Re: Workbench 1.3
By: Gary McCulloch to Charles Stephenson on Mon Apr 20 2020 08:37 pm

Sorry to hear you have Corona and I pray for a speedy recovery. I am
not sure how well AmigaForever will work, but I have seen quite a few C-Net boards on WinUAE and now one on MorphOS. So see what you can do and keep us informed.

Thank you, I really appriciate it.

C-Net looks to work pretty rock solid from what I've seen from calling. I've only seen a handful of AmigaExpress BBSes running. If I can't get it figured out, I'll prolly end up going to C-Net too
--- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
* Origin: The New Frontier ][ BBS [frontierbbs.net:23] - OH (1:226/17)

Re: Re: Workbench 1.3
By: Al DeRosa to Charles Stephenson on Tue Apr 21 2020 02:52 pm

Cool.. You will like it especially since you have all the ROMS and install disks needed to get going.. Be careful with VM's running the emulators they will slow you down. Basically, you are running a emulator inside an emulator. I found I just run WinUAE on a seperate PC which I consider my Amiga PC...

That was/is my long-term plan too. Can't do that til I move again though. I do have a spare desktop I was planning on installing ARCOS on. I've read/seen some
good things about it. but I'm running Linux and I know it won't lag as bad as in Windows. I've had almost zero lag when running any VM's in linux/Ubuntu
--- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
* Origin: The New Frontier ][ BBS [frontierbbs.net:23] - OH (1:226/17)

On 21 Apr 2020, Charles Stephenson said the following...

That was/is my long-term plan too. Can't do that til I move again
though. I do have a spare desktop I was planning on installing ARCOS on. I've read/seen some good things about it. but I'm running Linux and I know it won't lag as bad as in Windows. I've had almost zero lag when running any VM's in linux/Ubuntu --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux
* Origin: The New Frontier ][ BBS [frontierbbs.net:23] - OH (1:226/17)

I am running 3 VM's inside windows and have no lag on them.. It's when you
toss WinUAE inside a VM that you start to see lag.. My original plan with my boards was to have a VM for each one running off my Server, when I saw how
slow my CNet Amiga was inside the VM I knew it wasn't a good idea..
Hopefully, you won't experience a lag with Linux. I am moving my Server to a Linux based setup soon, I am hoping to get rid of all of the extra machines I have for each platform and just run VM's on it.. We'll see how it goes...

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
* Origin: The Wrong Number Family Of BBS' - Wrong Number ][ (1:267/157)

Emulating an emulator is like googling google. The world will come to an end ;)

We never thought you would believe us...especially since I'm from Iran with
the best reception for the Internet is on top of Big Ben...according to the Elders of the Internet. When it does come to an end...just call: 0118 999 881 999 119 725......3.

ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/04/21 (Windows/32)
* Origin: ACME BBS-W.Coyote & D.Brown are our best users. (1:340/1000)

On Apr 22nd 2:00 pm Al DeRosa said...

I am running 3 VM's inside windows and have no lag on them.. It's when you toss WinUAE inside a VM that you start to see lag.. My original plan with my boards was to have a VM for each one running off my Server, when I saw how slow my CNet Amiga was inside the VM I knew it wasn't a good idea.. Hopefully, you won't experience a lag with Linux. I am moving my Server to a Linux based setup soon, I am hoping to get rid of all of the extra machines I have for each platform and just run VM's on it.. We'll see how it goes...

Are all of your BBSes running under Windows? For some reason I thought you were
using Linux too. How much RAM does your Windows PC have, and what type of CPU? I'm just curious.

My Linux BBS/Box I have a i5 Lenovo (Small Form-Factor), headless, 10G RAM, 1.5TB HDD, Ubuntu 19.04. I'm running Synchronet, Enigma-BBS, WWIV, and Mystic and I haven't had any issues with lag, that relates to my PC. I have had issues
with connections (ISP).

I can't wait til I start working on AmigaExpess!




--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.11-beta (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

On Apr 22nd 6:00 pm Don Lowery said...

ARCOS on.

I've read/seen some good things about it.

Bought a used Lenovo ThinkCentre for $50. Upgraded to 12 GB & a 1 TB laptop drive I use for running ArcaOS. Got both at the same time as I got my tax refund back in February. Even upgraded the BIOS from 2013 to 2018.

Sounds like the perfect system for running a BBS on. I also have a Lenovo, it's
the Tiny Form Factor. I love it!

Anyway...everything is seen by ArcaOS. Been working with getting Telegard/2 working with SIO2K...SGMail or D'Bridge for a front end & FastEcho or Fmail for a JAM tosser. The reason is that TG/2 runs a JAM message base the same as Mystic. If Mystic eventually ends up with another OS/2-ArcaOS version...will head back to that.

My first BBS computer I bought when I came back online almost 3 years ago was a
older Intel Pentium system. After I transfered everything over to the Lenovo that PC has been collecting dust. I was planning on making that into either a OS/2 PC or a Amiga one. It has 2 modems in it. I'm planning on setting up a dial-in number. I have all the equipment for it.

You will like ArcaOS & many of the changes they have implemented. Want to stay with Warp 4.52...the company has a package to provide you with drivers & such for I believe $49 a year. When I got my version...also signed up for a year of support for $58 a year. Many believe it is pricey...but when you consider the amount of money being paid for upgrading Windows...the cost isn't that bad.

I did install a older version of ArcaOS on that unused desktop. I'm not even sure where I downloaded it from, but it was a old version. Even with that, it looks pretty good. I did have some boot issues. It would hang on occasion so I
put playing with it to the backburner.

Got any questions...feel free to ask. Sean Dennis over at MicroNet has helped myself & others as well. Want to see what the future looks like for Arca Noae...head to this PR: https://tinyurl.com/y72s8yye.

For sure, I'll be bugging you guys very soon!

Thanks for the info!



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.11-beta (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

Bought a used Lenovo ThinkCentre for $50. Upgraded to 12 GB & a 1 TB laptop drive I use for running ArcaOS. Got both at the same time as I

Sounds like the perfect system for running a BBS on. I also have a
Lenovo, it's the Tiny Form Factor. I love it!

It's small...sits on its side just beside my monitor which is sitting on an Allsop stand. Outta the way...access to the DVD drive & USB ports. Even using
a USB KVM switch to go between the two systems.

It came with an 8 GB SSD I took off it & added another 8 GB stick for about
$35 for a total of 12 GB. My desktop has just been upgraded to 2 8 GB sticks. The great thing about these systems is they were used in retail outlets...so
we get them super cheap for doing exactly what I'm doing. For that matter...thought about getting another RPi...but that would've cost me more...even though I have a 3B+ & a Zero I bought at the holidays.

ago was a older Intel Pentium system. After I transfered everything over to the Lenovo that PC has been collecting dust. I was planning on making that into either a OS/2 PC or a Amiga one. It has 2 modems in it. I'm

I was looking for a P4 system...but for the cost of 1 of those...I can buy at least 2 of these POS systems.

That didn't occur to me about using a stock ThinkCentre as an Amiga PC with WinUAE. As stupid as prices are for actual hardware...I could get 10-12 of these systems for the cost of an actual Amiga system which might not even
work.

I did install a older version of ArcaOS on that unused desktop. I'm not even sure where I downloaded it from, but it was a old version. Even
with that, it looks pretty good. I did have some boot issues. It would hang on occasion so I put playing with it to the backburner.

It does have some hangups once in a while...but whenever I get the board up & running...am going to let it run by itself.

Even found a Hobbes OS/2 CD set I got from Archive.org from 1995. Put that up...along with 4.52 to get others to start running it as well.

For sure, I'll be bugging you guys very soon!

NP!!! This has been a dream of mine to run a BBS under OS/2 with
Renegade...but with a native OS/2 version of Telegard...no reason to look at RG. Add to that if another version of Mystic for OS/2 comes out...will be running that...since TG/2 also does JAM message bases.

ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/04/21 (Windows/32)
* Origin: ACME BBS-W.Coyote & D.Brown are our best users. (1:340/1000)

On 23 Apr 2020, Charles Stephenson said the following...

Are all of your BBSes running under Windows? For some reason I thought
you were using Linux too. How much RAM does your Windows PC have, and
what type of CPU? I'm just curious.

I have 3 seperate machines for my boards, my PC board (Mystic VM, and a SynchroNet Door Server) run in 2 sepeate VM's on 1 machine .. This machine
has 16gigs Ram, i3 3.5ghz. The 3rd VM on this machine will be handling my
next board which will most likely be SynchroNet because I have been working
on 1 in the background.

The other 2 machines are both i3's 3.3ghz 1 with 4 gigs ram the other with 8, one runs WinUAE for my C-Net Amiga board, and the other machine runs a
instance of WinVice which runs my C64 Image BBS v2.0 and it also handles the BBS Servers for my 2 other Image BBS on real hardware...

Hope that helps some.. One other comment the VM that handles my Mystic board also handles Appache for my website and my login server and InterBBS File Server...

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
* Origin: The Wrong Number Family Of BBS' - Wrong Number ][ (1:267/157)

Al DeRosa wrote in a message to Charles Stephenson:

I've bought Amiga Forever I've been playing with it. I REALLY like it.
My goal is to run a Amiga VM in Ubuntu and set up Amiga Express and
setup a true Amiga BBS. Since I have Corona I'll have time to do it
now.... --- SBBSecho 3.10-Linux

Cool.. You will like it especially since you have all the ROMS and
install disks needed to get going.. Be careful with VM's running
the emulators they will slow you down. Basically, you are running a emulator inside an emulator. I found I just run WinUAE on a
seperate PC which I consider my Amiga PC...

Yeah, the ROMS were the main reason I bought both C64 Forever and Amiga Forever
as a package. The DVD that came with Amiga Forever was especially nice :)

Peace,
Robert

--- timEd/2 1.30+
* Origin: Omicron Theta/2 * Memphis, TN (1:261/20)

On 26 Apr 2020, Robert Wolfe said the following...

Yeah, the ROMS were the main reason I bought both C64 Forever and Amiga Forever as a package. The DVD that came with Amiga Forever was
especially nice :)

Exactly why I picked it up.. All I needed from it was the ROMS, I purchased AOS4.1 used it for a short period found AOS3.9 at a garage sale and use that for my BBS.. Probably going to buy 3.1.4 one of these days..

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A45 2020/02/18 (Windows/32)
* Origin: The Wrong Number Family Of BBS' - Wrong Number ][ (1:267/157)

On Apr 24th 2:00 am Don Lowery said...

an Allsop stand. Outta the way...access to the DVD drive & USB ports. Even using a USB KVM switch to go between the two systems.

It came with an 8 GB SSD I took off it & added another 8 GB stick for about $35 for a total of 12 GB. My desktop has just been upgraded to 2 8 GB sticks. The great thing about these systems is they were used in retail outlets...so we get them super cheap for doing exactly what I'm doing. For that matter...thought about getting another RPi...but that would've cost me more...even though I have a 3B+ & a Zero I bought at the holidays.

I love the system! Mine only has 8G of Ram, I'm going to upgrade it, add atleast another 4, but prolly 8. I do like the fact that it's pretty much like having a laptop. I also plan on upgrading the HDD. I have a 1TB external and a 500G internal. I'd like to have a 2TB+ HDD. I am having trouble with certain USB hardware. I have 2 USB modems that I can get to init. in Linux (manually). If I go to reboot, linux doesn't see them. I have to unplug and replug them into the USB Ports. It does it on any USB Ports. I find that kind of strange.



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.11-beta (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

On Apr 24th 9:30 am Al DeRosa said...

machine has 16gigs Ram, i3 3.5ghz. The 3rd VM on this machine will be handling my next board which will most likely be SynchroNet because I have been working on 1 in the background.

The other 2 machines are both i3's 3.3ghz 1 with 4 gigs ram the other with 8, one runs WinUAE for my C-Net Amiga board, and the other machine runs a instance of WinVice which runs my C64 Image BBS v2.0 and it also handles the BBS Servers for my 2 other Image BBS on real hardware...

That's quite a setup! I was running basiclly 5 BBSes, on 2 computers. I'm down to running 3 public (and 2 test) on one computer. (i5 3Mhz/8G RAM) I do want to upgrade my RAM. Prolly 16, but atleast 12G.



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.11-beta (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

On Apr 26th 3:01 pm Robert Wolfe said...

Forever as a package. The DVD that came with Amiga Forever was especially nice :)

It IS a pretty nice software package. I've been wanting to start working on it but I had th tweak/fix my other 2 main BBSes first. Now I pretty much have thgem fixed, NOW I can play around with it!



--- ENiGMA 1/2 v0.0.11-beta (linux; x64; 10.15.2)
* Origin: The Amiga Frontier BBS |frontierbbs.net:8888| OH (1:226/16)

I love the system! Mine only has 8G of Ram, I'm going to upgrade it,
add atleast another 4, but prolly 8. I do like the fact that it's pretty much like having a laptop. I also plan on upgrading the HDD. I have a
1TB external and a 500G internal. I'd like to have a 2TB+ HDD. I am

Ended up taking out the 8 GB SSD & putting in a 1 TB laptop drive. The only thing I don't like about the system is no reset button.

having trouble with certain USB hardware. I have 2 USB modems that I
can get to init. in Linux (manually).
If I go to reboot, linux doesn't see them. I have to unplug and replug them into the USB Ports. It does it on any USB Ports. I find that kind
of strange.

Not being versed in Linux...have no idea on what's going on. On the other hand...if I can find a copy of UAE for OS/2-Arca...may attempt to set up that
& Vice for a way to play around with Commodore software.

ACME BBS-Member of fsxNet/WWIVNet/SciNet/AmigaNet/VKRadio/FidoNet/MicroNet.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A46 2020/04/21 (Windows/32)
* Origin: ACME BBS-W.Coyote & D.Brown are our best users. (1:340/1000)