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  • Re: Mar-a-lago search wa

    From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Ib Joe on Sat Jun 10 00:25:12 2023
    On 06-09-23 05:59, Ib Joe <=-
    spoke to Alan Ianson about Re: Mar-a-lago search war <=-


    On 08 Jun 2023, Alan Ianson said the following...

    Donald Trump has not been president since Jan 2021.


    And he declassified the documents on the way out the door...

    As of 21 January 2021, he no longer had any authority to either
    declassify documents nor to receive classified documents.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


    ... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 00:26:58, 10 Jun 2023
    ___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

    --- Maximus/NT 3.01
    * Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)
  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Mike Powell on Sun Jun 11 01:22:06 2023
    On 06-10-23 14:23, Mike Powell <=-
    spoke to Alan Ianson about Mar-a-lago search warrant <=-


    The classification of these documents is not the issue.

    If trump had simply returned the documents when he was asked to we would not talking about this.

    Actually it is an issue. If they were not classified, he'd not be in trouble for not returning them when asked.

    Wrong. Although the 31 documents included in the indictment are
    classified, they are still National Defense Information whether or not
    they are. I have been told that in fact the Espionage Act on NDI was
    written *before* the current classification system came into being --
    i.e. the violation of that act does not depend on them being classified,
    just that they are NDI. Whether or not that interpretation is true or
    not, I leave to the lawyers.

    What was Trump doing with these documents and why?

    If you had read what IB Joe posted, supposedly he was hoping to use
    them to prove the Russian Collusion hoax was the hoax it turned out to
    be.

    I do not believe that any of the 31 documents had any bearing on the
    request that IBJ posted. They are of topics that are on totally
    different subjects.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


    ... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 01:11:42, 11 Jun 2023
    ___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

    --- Maximus/NT 3.01
    * Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)
  • From Mike Powell@1:2320/105 to DALE SHIPP on Sun Jun 11 08:17:00 2023
    Actually it is an issue. If they were not classified, he'd not be in trouble for not returning them when asked.

    Wrong. Although the 31 documents included in the indictment are
    classified, they are still National Defense Information whether or not
    they are. I have been told that in fact the Espionage Act on NDI was
    written *before* the current classification system came into being --
    i.e. the violation of that act does not depend on them being classified,
    just that they are NDI. Whether or not that interpretation is true or
    not, I leave to the lawyers.

    If they contain NDI, I would expect them to be classified, so I stand on my statement. If they were not classified (because they contain NDI), he'd
    not be in trouble for not returning them.

    They were apparently classified, because they do apparently contain NDI, so
    he is being investigated.

    If this was before the current classification system, then he'd still be in trouble, yes.


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  • From Dale Shipp@1:261/1466 to Mike Powell on Mon Jun 12 00:46:00 2023
    On 06-11-23 08:17, Mike Powell <=-
    spoke to Dale Shipp about Re: Mar-a-lago search wa <=-

    Wrong. Although the 31 documents included in the indictment are
    classified, they are still National Defense Information whether or not
    they are. I have been told that in fact the Espionage Act on NDI was written *before* the current classification system came into being --
    i.e. the violation of that act does not depend on them being classified, just that they are NDI. Whether or not that interpretation is true or
    not, I leave to the lawyers.

    If they contain NDI, I would expect them to be classified, so I stand
    on my statement. If they were not classified (because they contain
    NDI), he'd not be in trouble for not returning them.

    They were apparently classified, because they do apparently contain
    NDI, so he is being investigated.

    If this was before the current classification system, then he'd still
    be in trouble, yes.

    The distinction only comes into play against the claim that Trump
    declassified documents. Even if that were true, the fact that they were
    still NDI means that they are still violations of the Espionage Act, or
    at least that was some of the reporting a while back. It is really a
    minor, perhaps mute, point.

    Dale Shipp
    fido_261_1466 (at) verizon (dot) net
    (1:261/1466)


    ... Shipwrecked in Silver Spring, Maryland. 00:50:40, 12 Jun 2023
    ___ Blue Wave/DOS v2.30

    --- Maximus/NT 3.01
    * Origin: Owl's Anchor (1:261/1466)