On 19 Dec 20 06:48:00, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to Maurice Kinal:

Even if we want everyone migrating to the new software, there should be som transition period, while we _must_ (as in FTA-1006) maintain compatibility.

Fidonet is mostly a dead-end... its just a silly network people are mostly happy to just trade banter so long as shit works. Any changes or
improvements to established standards or practice is decades too late and a likely a waste of time. There will never be a massive software-migration and any desire to have everyone on new software will need to wait a few decades while natural-selection takes care of the stubborn ones.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

On 19 Dec 20 13:57:00, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to Nick Andre:

Fidonet is mostly a dead-end... its just a silly network people are mostly happy to just trade banter so long as shit works.

Please speak for yourself. Or at most for your part of the network, if you exactly know the situation inside.

As a Fido developer of a product used in the back-office of two zones and as as a ZC of one of them, I believe my contributions are somewhat valid here if you are willing to listen and not act like a petulent child.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

On 19 Dec 20 14:08:09, Rob Swindell said the following to Maurice Kinal:

Your proposal is not backwards compatible.

Unrelated, can you shoot me an email... nandre -at- net229 -dot- org

Had some questions for you...

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

On 19 Dec 20 18:39:28, Rob Swindell said the following to Maurice Kinal:

I haven't really proposed anything, but if I were, it would be a new contro paragraph (kludge line) in the variable length portion of the packed-messag This would have no impact on older/existing systems and yet would allow new systems to utilize the more precise date/time information if they wished.

I'm not a fan of kludging things to death, but this sounds more logical than outright changing something in packets, thus in my case changing tosser code that has been mostly unchanged since '89.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

On 20 Dec 20 03:14:41, Maurice Kinal said the following to Rob Swindell:

They are at best a placebo that ignores the real issue. A proper cure is needed and has been for 20 years now. Control paragraphs do nothing to sol the real problem which is the two digit year. It *MUST* die. It is the *ONLY* way.

Unfortunately its going to be difficult to draft a proposal to let something die versus something that lets systems continue to run.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

Good ${greeting_time}, Nick!

19 Dec 2020 09:06:54, you wrote to me:

Fidonet is mostly a dead-end... its just a silly network people

are

mostly happy to just trade banter so long as shit works.

Please speak for yourself. Or at most for your part of the network,
if you exactly know the situation inside.

As a Fido developer of a product used in the back-office of two zones

git clone what?

and as as a ZC of one of them,

Do you mean that one consisting of less than 500 listed nodes, with most of them being duplicates operated by one sysop?

Good for a network level. Acceptable for a region. Miserable for a zone.

I believe my contributions are somewhat valid here if you are willing
to listen and not act like a petulent child.

That's you who are considering yourself one of "silly network people"...


--
Alexey V. Vissarionov aka Gremlin from Kremlin
gremlin.ru!gremlin; +vii-cmiii-ccxxix-lxxix-xlii

... that's why I really dislike fools.
--- /bin/vi
* Origin: ::1 (2:5020/545)

Hey Nick!

Unfortunately its going to be difficult to draft a proposal to
let something die versus something that lets systems continue to
run.

Speaking as the one who wrote it, it was easy. As for whether or not it gets accepted, rejected or totally ignored I was/am prepared to go along with whatever the powers that be determine to do ... or not do as the case may be. As per usual I will soldier on.

Life is good,
Maurice

... Don't cry for me I have vi.
--- GNU bash, version 5.1.0(1)-release (x86_64-motorshed-linux-gnu)
* Origin: Little Mikey's Brain - Ladysmith BC, Canada (1:153/7001)

On 20 Dec 20 16:52:00, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to Nick Andre:

I believe my contributions are somewhat valid here if you are willing to listen and not act like a petulent child.

That's you who are considering yourself one of "silly network people"...

LOL. I stand by all my words and your type of response and others you've written before - the "fag" remarks and all that - makes you the teenage script-kiddie of the network, never to be taken seriously, privileged to sit
at the grownups table for Christmas dinner, screams murder when the Iphone is taken away. Thats unfortunate because you do not speak for all of Region 50.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

On 21 Dec 20 11:22:58, Joachim Probst said the following to Maurice Kinal:

Being a few days in hospital I will take the first post to answer. As we ha seen, backward compatibility is always a problem with old software. But wou the solution not be, simply defining a new version of the pkt-format? The

This has been brought up so many times over the years... and beaten to death.

There is very little software in use that can be updated to a new packet format. Many Sysops prefer running software that is either abandonware or cannot be updated any further.

We have self-appointed experts who believe in dumping everything for new software but go to crickets chirping when asked "who enforces this". There is no longer any real means to tell a Sysop that they must use something newer. There is no requirement for anyone to use something newer.

Therefore at this point, new structures is a whimsical fantasy. At best, we are stuck with kludge lines to add anything new.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)